These forums are read only, please use our new forums here.

Main :: POD HD


Support forums for all POD HD products


Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by neo10neo on 2011-07-13 19:41:46

Hi all,

When using the Pod HD500, I typically have it set in pedalboard mode (utilziing footswitches 1-8) rather than preset mode. For anyone else who does this, I was wondering what effects you typically like to have in your board. I know its simply a matter of preference, but I'm curious to see what everyone likes to use and what footswithces they assign them to.

I always have a volume pedal set, and usuaully a chorus (the analog boss one), 2 delays (usually digital delay), and reverb (spring or plate).

Feel free to post your patches for convenience. I know it's all a matter of preference, but I'm just curious to see what effects you fellow POD owners like to use regulary when in pedalboard mode.



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by tommasi on 2011-07-14 03:35:17

I also use my 500 in pedalboard mode, but we seem to be a minority. Also, I have found that considering that some effects (like reverb) are most often on all the time, while others are very DSP-hungry, it's essentially impossible to have 8 useful different assignment for the footswitches. There are exceptions, though. Here's what I do:

on the top row I keep the 'pre' effects -- that includes distorsion (a RAT or a tube driver, usually), sometimes a phaser or a tremolo. On the bottom row I keep the "post" effects, typically chorus, flanger, delay, rotary. I have reverb on all the time, so no footswitch assigned. I usually have exp1 assigned to a wah, and exp2 assigned to a pedal volume. When I have no slot available, I assign exp2 to control the channel volume.

For certain pedalboard configurations I assign multiple effects to the same footswitch, in order to engage a combination of those, or to alternate between 2 configurations. For example, to switch from a chorused delayed clean tone to a gated, distorted one by pressing one footswitch. This type of assignment, however, mostly stems from the fact that I like to run my pedal in pedalboard mode, and hence patch changing is a 2-tap job, otherwise it would make probably more sense to use 2 patches and be done with it.

I think it's absolutely brilliant to have all this versatility.



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by neo10neo on 2011-07-14 07:59:17

The POD is indeed very versatile. So you're using amp modeling when in pedalboard mode? I have my POD plugged into the fx loop of my amp, preserving the tone of my "real" amp, and I'm using only post-effects on the pod (chorus, delay, reverb, etc). Does anyone else use the pedalboard config without amp modeling like myself?



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by TheRealZap on 2011-07-14 09:26:21

don't know about pedalboard users specifically...

but many users use the 4 cable method (4CM) to use their amp OR the pod models

not sure if you looked into that at all...

curious though, why didn't you just get the M13?



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by neo10neo on 2011-07-14 09:42:33

Because I can use the POD HD500 as an audio interface for recording and use the amp modeling for direct recording. Also, the POD has an expression/volume pedal for live use.

The 4CM doesn't sound good with my amp setup. It seems to drastically change the tone of my amp.



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by TheRealZap on 2011-07-14 09:44:45

mostly just curious...

but have you tried changing the line/stomp setting on the FX loop? that could adversely affect 4CM.

in either case, its all good as long as it works for you.



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by neo10neo on 2011-07-14 10:30:40

I'll try the 4CM again one of these days, and pay attention to the line/stomp setting. Do you use the 4CM?



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by TheRealZap on 2011-07-14 11:06:30

nah... i got the DT50-112 so i use the L6LINK method



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by tommasi on 2011-07-14 11:32:20

Indeed I use the pod for amp simulations. I don't usually change patch mid-song, since either most of the patch stays the same, and only changes for an effect or two, or radically different sounds seem to be unnatural within the same song. SO I still use the pedalboard mode to control the patch on the fly.



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by neo10neo on 2011-07-14 12:55:08

Very nice



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by ronnied50 on 2011-07-14 13:04:16
+1 on pedal board mode,Just started using it that way a week ago,Pre effects up top and post down below but might change that.

Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by neo10neo on 2011-07-14 14:30:18

Pedalboard mode is amazing. I made this thread because it seems most people don't operate their POD in pedalboard mode. Are you using the 4CM? Are you using amp modeling?



RE: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by Line6Don on 2011-07-14 16:46:51

Hey neo10neo,

This does not appear to be a technical support question, but more of a opinion based question so I will go ahead and leave this thread open for further contributions from the community.



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by gregr on 2011-07-14 17:17:08

I used to use pedalboard mode to switch between two separate chains, one for rhythm and one for lead, which usually had a couple of things like a phaser and wah in front, common to both chains.  This was I was able to keep delay tails when switching back to rhythm.

It proved to be too difficult for me to keep track of which button did what, so I went back to preset mode.



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by whiteop on 2011-07-14 17:35:51

I use mine in pedalboard  mode and have about 4 or 5 core patches using my fav am sims and usually 5-6 effects like this:  FS1 OD / Dist  FS2 Modulation FS3 Reverb FS4 Delay FS5 Lead Boost FS6 another effect of choice usually modulation or delay FS8 FX Loop on/off  I get a lot of mileage out of using it this way.



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by neo10neo on 2011-07-14 18:17:20

What do you typically use as a "lead boost"? Also, how do you like to use the fx loop?



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by whiteop on 2011-07-14 18:25:24

I use a comp boost for leads and turn the compression down and the level up. I usually have a pedal (usually another delay) turned on and use the FX loop to turn it in and off. It sounds best that way.



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by gregr on 2011-07-14 19:32:48

Even with the compression turned down, I've found that the comp boost still affects your dynamics.  There are ways to implement a linear change, though none as elegant as assigning a switch to toggle a parameter, which these units cannot do.

Please consider soliciting Line 6 with my feature request:

http://line6.com/community/thread/63211



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by neo10neo on 2011-07-14 20:02:16

I'll check it out. Thanks for the link.



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by Nick_Mattocks on 2011-07-15 00:36:46

I'm currently using my HD500 in pedal board mode because having the ability to switch the FX on and off using the front row of switches rather than the back row means I'm far less likely to get my size 9's pressing the front row of switches unintentionally

The big drawback using the HD500 in pedalboard mode is that it requires mre tap dancing than before to simply change a preset.

I wish it were possible via the software to swap the FS1 to FS4 row with the FS5 to FS8 row as accurate FX on/off toggling is more important to me than switching presets which is something that mostly only happens between songs; but switching presets with one foot press (within a single bank) is desirable too, so if the switch rows could be alternated easily I could use my HD500 in ABCD mode AND not worry about pressing the wrong switch as I over-step the front row

I don't use 4CM either - I have a DT50 212 to which I connect the HD500 by L6 Link, however I also regularly use the HD500 with a Marshall valve head and 4x12 and for me there's no benefit in going 4CM as the HD500 does the Marshall pre amp emulation to a tee.

For a lead boost I either add a Boost Comp or more likely I just have a spearate patch completely with the Channel Volume set higher, or if I'm going straight to the Marshall using a 1/4" output I often just plug in to an MXR Micro Amp which is in line between the HD500 and the Marshall's FX Return

Nick



Re: Marshall to a tee
by gregr on 2011-07-15 00:49:37

Sorry for being off topic, but I've found that the HD J-800 preamp model has far too much gain, practically no bass response, a spike in the low treble and a poorly defined top end compared to the real thing.



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by gregr on 2011-07-15 00:54:39

neo10neo wrote:

I'll check it out. Thanks for the link.

You're welcome, and thank YOU for the consideration!



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by neo10neo on 2011-07-15 07:40:50

Interesting stuff to consider. I've got to try incorportating the "boost comp" into some of my boards. Would any fellow "pedal board mode" users be interested in posting their patches here? I'd be curious to check/try them out on my rig.



Re: Marshall to a tee
by TheRealZap on 2011-07-15 07:53:48

have you tried adjusting the new master volume control on the amp...

i tend to think the 800 is done well...



Re: Marshall to a tee
by Nick_Mattocks on 2011-07-15 08:01:34

gregr wrote:

Sorry for being off topic, but I've found that the HD J-800 preamp model has far too much gain, practically no bass response, a spike in the low treble and a poorly defined top end compared to the real thing.

Really?   I have the real thing here and plugging the HD500 into the real thing's power amp section sounds pretty much spot on to me with Cab modelling off and the output mode being set to Stack Pwr Amp, but there will almost certainly be variations in preformance and response between one real amp and another supposedly and on-paper identical amp, so that said I wouldn't doubt what you are saying with your rig, but here it's working well for me using a real Marshall tube amp head as the donor power amp - or with the DT-50 for that matter.

Nick.



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by spaceatl on 2011-07-15 08:18:00

I use the FX loop for lead boost in the HD400...1 short 1/4 patch strapped into the Left FX send return...that forces things mono also depending on the boost type....set mixe to 100%

set the Loop pre to drive the amp model...post is clean gain...can be configure patch to patch...FX loop becomes a booster...



Re: Marshall to a tee
by gregr on 2011-07-15 09:32:42

Yes Nick, really; otherwise I wouldn't have posted it.

I tested the J-800 pre without cabinet modeling into the power amp in of a real Marshall tube amp driving and real Marshall cabinet.  That doesn't really matter, however, so long as you're doing an apples to apples comparison with everything else held constant (preamp vs. preamp, cabinet and poweramp remain unchanged).  I wish I had made recordings at the time.

J-800 PRE: too much gain, no bass response, lacking definition in the high end with a non-Marshally peak in the low trebble.



Re: Marshall to a tee
by gregr on 2011-07-15 09:34:12

TheRealZap wrote:

have you tried adjusting the new master volume control on the amp...

i tend to think the 800 is done well...

I was comparing the preamp section only.



Re: Marshall to a tee
by Nick_Mattocks on 2011-07-15 10:04:29

OK - fair enough.  All you can do is speak as you find.  As I said I'm not doubting your experience and what you hear with your rig.  It's subjective based on a lot of subtle physical variables including the host power amp which can be variable due to the brand of tubes, age of tubes, bias settings etc...and the speakers in use in the cab and the design of the cab.  You have to remember that the pre-amp and power amp that have been modelled have probably been restored as close to original spec for that specific model as possible and that as a result the amp may be considered to have been optimised in a certain way, which is not to say that the modelled pre-amp is better or worse than the real preamp in your specific amp - just different perhaps.   Beyond that it's simply a matter of opinion.  I'm not arguing with what you heard.  I was just surprised at your comment that's all.

My experience is obviously different to yours though - it works well here and as far as I'm concerned with my HD500, my Marshall amp + Marshall 4x12 with my guitars it is pretty hard to tell the difference in a straight A/B comparison with my set-up

Nick



Re: Marshall to a tee
by gregr on 2011-07-15 10:21:07

Typical stock, all tube-based JCM800s (eg: 2203) simply do not have that amount of gain in the preamp section and provide lots of bass.

Again(!), if you're comparing preamp to preamp, the rest does not matter, unless you're suggesting the rest of the system (including the auditory system of the listener) is masking those differences.  In my case, the Marshall amp and cabinet were not masking the differences.  If I had made a recording I would have also been able to demonstrate that my psycho/auditory system was not creating differences that didn't actually exist.



Re: Marshall to a tee
by Nick_Mattocks on 2011-07-15 11:30:33

gregr wrote:

Typical stock, all tube-based JCM800s (eg: 2203) simply do not have that amount of gain in the preamp section and provide lots of bass.

Again(!), if you're comparing preamp to preamp, the rest does not matter, unless you're suggesting the rest of the system (including the auditory system of the listener) is masking those differences.  In my case, the Marshall amp and cabinet were not masking the differences.  If I had made a recording I would have also been able to demonstrate that my psycho/auditory system was not creating differences that didn't actually exist.

Hmmm...

I understand what you're saying.  Pre-amp to pre-amp comparisons are not really possible without introducuing other equipment and necessarily other factors.   When it comes to tube amps it is also entirely possible that two supposedly identical amps based on the spec on paper can sound quite different in practice as I said before as in practice whilst in an ideal world all components used in building an amp would be identical and therefore they would perform in exactly the same way, the reality is often that components get changed between different batches because of the supply chain and what happens to be available.  Circuits also undergo minor revisions from time to time.  The age of the tubes the brand of the tubes the voltage supplied to thise tubes and the frequency of the power supply all have a subtle effect on how things will actually sound.  There are so many potential variables between pre-amps and power amps which are supposedly identical that will affect the whole signal chain.

We're obviously hearing something quite different.   Again I'm not arguing with anything you say about your system.  The pre-amp that was actually modelled will be what's being reproduced in the POD HD and that specific pre-amp is the key here.  I am pretty certain that before the amp and pre-amp were modelled they received some attention in terms of a service.  I'm not aware of any modifications to that amp which would cause it to behave differently, however I am pretty sure that the amp actually modelled by Line 6 will have been selected because it sounded the best to them from possibly a number of possible candidates they might have auditioned.

But nevertheless, my experience/opinion of the J-800 Pre from the HD500 into my Marshall kit is obviously very different to yours with your Marshall kit.

The only real wayto test what we are hearing would be to place my rig, your rig, a couple of different JCM-800 amps/speakers in the same room with the amp/pre-amp that was the basis of the model and to perform a proper A/B test - but that's not going to happen in reality.

A set of comparitive recordings isn't really going to work either unless absolutely everything is identical.

Personally I'm happy with the J-800 Pre and for me it performs pretty much as the real thing does in my own comparitive testing.  It is subjective and a matter of personal opinion/preference and without knowing the fine detail about the specific pre-amp and power amp that were modelled and actually having that amp in the room there'd be no way to come anywhere near actually proving or disproving that the JCM800 pre-amp model actually sounds accurate when compared with the real pre-amp that was modelled

If you believe it's wrong and I'm not saying you are right or wrong in your assessment as it's your opinion and your belief, then you should submit product feedback so that the product development team can be made aware directly using the Product Feedback link you'll find using the Contact Us link at the foot of the page and maybe the JCM800 pre-amp model will be looked at again

Nick



Re: Marshall to a tee
by gregr on 2011-07-15 11:58:55

Those are great points indeed, Nick.  Luckily HD500 to HD500 won't have all the variables at play.  Even if the HD500 model does match the actual preamp being modeled (which I am seriously doubting if I am to believe the unit was stock and in perfect working order), that model is way out of the JCM800 ballpark with too much gain and not enough bass.  These differences are not even subtle and not easily attributable to tolerances wheras the top-end differences are more subtle and could be attributable to tolerances.  Luckily gain can be rolled back, but unfortunately it doesn't work that way when there is insufficient bass response.

Out of curiousity, could you tell me which Marshall head and cabinet you are using?



Re: Marshall to a tee
by Nick_Mattocks on 2011-07-15 13:03:21

Right now I have two Marshall heads that are mine: TSL100 and a JVM205H which I can either use with a Marshall 4x12 loaded with Celestion V30s or with one or two 1922 cabs loaded with Celestion G12T75s.  I have a little 1x12 2554 combo too.  Additionally I have access to a JCM800 head too - I'm not sure of the model - I think it may be a 2205, and I've used other JCM800 heads over the years..

Nick



Re: Marshall to a tee
by gregr on 2011-07-15 14:17:08

I  regularly use a JVM410H and own a JCM 900 2500 that is collecting dust.  While the JCM900 does have a diode clipping stage, it can be circumvented by turning the gain to zero, making it sound very much like a JCM800 2204.  I occasionally have access to both a JCM800 2203 and a JMP 2203 as well.  None of these four heads are lacking in bass like the model found in the HD500, and they shouldn't since they have very similar topologies and tone stacks.  Cabinets used are Marshall 1960A and 1960AC.

Be careful when comparing levels of gain against the 2205, which, like the JCM900 2500, also has a diode clipping stage feeding the last gain stage before the cathode follower that drives the tone stack.  Remember, Line 6 claims to model a 2204 which has exactly the same preamp as a 2203.  Also be careful when comparing gain and tone with the JVM205.  The closest you will get to the 2204 on a JVM205 is clean/crunch orange.  There has been a lot of discussion about the tomfoolery in the manual for the two-channel JVM backed by schematic comparisons and frequency sweeps.  Clean/crunch orange on the JVM2 is essentially the same as Crunch orange on the JVM4, which is their approximation of a 2203/2204.  The overdrive channel of the JVM2 is the same as the overdrive 2 channel of the JVM4 where the middle control has been shifted downward in frequency.

HTH



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by wjoyce on 2012-09-30 13:17:41

Ok, I know it's an old thread, but this is EXACTLY what I need - a third footswitch mode that moves preset selection to the back row.  I find it hard to program patches that require all 8 without running out of DSP, and I'm forever hitting the wrong FS when aiming for the back row of footswitches.



Re: Your configuration in pedalboard mode
by UncleFestis on 2012-10-06 09:00:48

tommasi wrote:

For certain pedalboard configurations I assign multiple effects to the same footswitch, in order to engage a combination of those, or to alternate between 2 configurations.

This is what I was looking for,  I want to kick in 10db of gain and some delay for leads only.  I can just set up on footswitch for leads!




The information above may not be current, and you should direct questions to the current forum or review the manual.